From: vince@offshore.ai (Vincent Cate)
Newsgroups: sci.space.tech
Subject: Re: Lunar Sample Return via Tether
References: <9186edb5.0312061749.206011fa@posting.google.com> <b0ce55f4.0312071
854.6b7b8b22@posting.google.com>
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Message-ID: <9186edb5.0312080237.2e387357@posting.google.com>

cfrjlr@yahoo.com (Charles F. Radley) wrote in message
news:<b0ce55f4.0312071854.6b7b8b22@posting.google.com>...
> Nice idea, but not original.   Hoyt, Forward and Moravec have each
> proposed using tethers for lunar landing and sample return some
> years ago.

I realize that they proposed tethers for the Moon; however, I have
not seen them point out that you could pick up samples without any
infrastructure in place on the Moon.  The thing that might be
original is that a single probe, with no advance landing on the moon,
could use a tether to scoop up samples.

> It can be done even more cheaply than you propose.
>
> You do not even need any ion drive or propulsion at all actually.
> You can do it entirely with zero momentum exchange, you simply
> deposit payloads on to the lunar surface whose mass equals that of
> the samples you remove.

If we use an ion drive of 10,000 seconds ISP, it is throwing xenon
out the back at about 98 km/sec.  To pick up something from the
Moon we need to give it 1.6 km/sec of momentum.  So with the momentum
from 1 Kg of xenon we can pick up 98 kps / 1.6 kps or about 61 Kg
of regolith.  If you simply deposited equal mass on the lunar surface
you would only pick up 1 Kg for every 1 Kg you put down.  So this way
is cheaper for a probe on a sample return type mission.

> For the details, take a look at these web links:
>
> http://www.tethers.com/MXTethers3.html
>
> http://www.tethers.com/MXTethers.html

When I say "lunar sample return" I mean that there is nothing already
in place on the Moon.  I have not seen anything in these or any
others papers I have read that indicates they were thinking of a
sample return type mission.  Sure people have looked at Lunar
tethers.  And I do think that two way lunar tether traffic would be
*really cool*.  In particular once we have lots of tourists going to
the moon and coming back.

  -- Vince
